M*CARBO Brotherhood

Correct Fore Hand On Rifle Or Carbine


#1

This is a question to all of the ex military guys, LE officers, or any formally trained shooters. Rifle or carbine forehand position from standing. I’ve seen guys holding the fore end close in (near the magazine on an AR type) and I’ve seen guys holding their fore arm almost straight out with the hand kind of crossed over the barrel. And ice seen guys somewhat in the middle. So which way is the “correct” way? And why? Or is it just a preference thing? I just kind of do what feels natural to me, and I’m not a terrible shot. But since I’ve never had any formal training, just wondering if I’m doing something wrong. Probably won’t change but sometimes curious about it.


#2

@Jperr really no correct way. I hold mine as far down the rail as I can for two reasons. I tilt and lock my wrist forward to help mitigate recoil and also be able to “drive” the rifle in the direction I want it to go better. Holding the forend real close gives better stability for a long range shot if you can use your support arm to center your base close to your body but is not very good for recoil management or target acquisition. My two cents.


#3

@Jperr,
I tend to hold in closer to the magazine most of the time with my forend arm elbow resting against my gut. I seem more stable then. The exception is if I am shooting at a moving target. If I’m sweeping across on a running deer or hog I seem to be more fluid (and have more control) by holding further out towards the end of the forend. No real reason why, just seems to work for me. If I’m benchrest shooting, I don’t even touch the forend, just rest on bags or a bipod.


#4

This is a great question and I’ve learned a lot from watching the videos here and on YouTube. I’ve never been formally rifle trained, the S2k is my first rifle. My initial instincts were to tac it out as much as possible - hence the KT420 forend, optics, laser, Olight, foregrip - in addition to the MCARBO goodies. Going for a poor man’s MP5. In my mind.

In practicality, after shooting it awhile, I find the KT420 forend a little bit short for me, foregrip is unnecessary, the Olight is in the way. And I’m sure it’s a practice thing, but I way prefer a laser sight over a red dot. So effortless not having to pump my vision back’n forth from the target to a red blob.

So anyway, my tastes are evolving as my understanding of all this increases. I’m getting the M Series kind of as a do over, back to the basics of what the S2k is; maybe a different ergonomics with the new optic mount and sight will bring a new perspective on the deal. Then I’ll even have the option of trying some of these fore hand positions.

Plus, on top of all that, I’ll have TWO badda$$ SUB2000s!!:laughing:


#5

@Boomchucker

Hey JB, In my opinion firearms are ‘supposed to be’ a less expensive hobby than automobiles (coming from an ‘entire line’ of mechanics in my family tree!) One would think that a VALUABLE lesson learned would be to change out one small part at a time and keep logs on how those changes improve/debunk your equipment so that one can make it the MOST VALUABLE firearm designed MOST COMFORTABLE to you!!! However, I got into the CRAZE myself and find myself owning more equipment than the most well designed! What is up with this??? :crazy_face::+1:


#6

Yeah I ended up going back to the OEM hand guard for that reason.

@Jperr right now the “C-Clamp” is the rage and like @Kona said, I have seen a lot of guys getting really aggressive with their grip techniques.

That said not everyone does it that way and there are a lot of old (and very good) shooters who use a different techniques.

You will always see me elbow down, support hand under the grip, simply because I can’t turn a corner worth a damn with my chicken wing hanging out there! :grin::+1:


#7

Not LEO or ex-military, but I grew up with rifles and have always favored the classic “cradle” grip with elbow below including for my unmodified S2K. I therefore was somewhat surprised to find that I much preferred the grip provided by the attachments in the photos below. A flashlight pressure switch has been removed where the Velcro is showing in the photos. I do NOT like having the index finger in that position without having the thumb stop also in position; otherwise the thumb has nowhere to go.


So for unmodified, I still favor the cradle grip with elbow below. But if I can modify, I will go with the option above.


#8

@JoeFridaySays that is quite the set-up Brian. Can you zoom camera out a bit so can see how all goes together?


#9

@Johnksg Not a problem. See the images below. It looks heavy and cluttered but it really isn’t. All of the components are small and light and the firearm does not feel unbalanced at all. A slight clenching of the muscle at the base of the thumb activates the light; pretty much by just thinking about it. The first light died from strain/stress where the remote exited the rear and while the manufacturer provided a free replacement, I epoxied around that area to reduce the chance of a second failure. The laser is not really needed, but it is a green Q-Series by Protec, visible in full sun, that I picked up at a bargain. It has lost zero once, but was somehow back on target when I turned it off then back on.

Longer view

Reverse Side showing wire routing, etc.

Rear view from angle

Top view from angle


#10

@JoeFridaySays so what is that grip on the side of your S2K? Never seen it before. What do you use it for?

Thanks Brian!


#11

@Johnksg Note that unlike most angled grips, this one has a place in the front for your forefinger which normally would be wrapped on the other side of the gun. When your forefinger goes there, your thumb is then sticking straight up on the side of the gun. It can press against the side, curl over the top in a “C-clamp” or press forward against something like this thumb stop which is what I believe it was called. It came with the main grip when I ordered it off E-Bay. I’ve since learned the main grip was a knock off of a brand name grip made by Fab Defense which offers the same “thumb stop” and calls it a “Versatile Tactical Support.” The Fab Defense Web site is below and you will pay a serious premium for the brand name products.

https://www.fab-defense.com/en/category-foregrips/id-699/ergonomic-pointing-grip.html

Bottom line is that I like the added dimension of pressing forward that the thumb stop adds to the grip, combined with the pulling back aspect of the forefinger grip and the wraparound of the other fingers. It just all feels really stable.


#12

@JoeFridaySays Interesting concept. I went to their online store to check price of the VTS . I could see just running with that to properly index every time. :grin::+1:


#13

@Johnksg Don’t overlook the need for a section of side rail to mount it.


#14

@JoeFridaySays Side rails I have by the buckets. But thanks for the look out!:grin::+1:


#15

Not to get too far off topic, but how is that sight working out for you? I ordered and received one, but I am having difficulty acquiring the horizon line and the delta.


#16

@LenC There is definitely a learning curve and you need to give it some time. It is just so different from anything you are used to and a strange mix of sight and optic. I really like it a lot and found it helped me to think of and use it more like a bright green iron sight with a delta front post already aligned and ready to place on target than anything else. My 28 year old son absolutely hated it with a passion but after about three outings and 120 or so rounds he grudgingly conceded the last time out that it was growing on him.

You might also try moving it closer or farther away as that can dramatically change the size of the delta. Mine is as close to my eye as the S2K standard top rail will permit and sits on a 0.87" riser.


#17

Thanks for the quick reply. I will try your suggestions.


#18

@LenC I reread what I told you and realized some of it may have been unclear. The mistake I made initially was trying to look through the sight for everything. You do have to look through it, but only to locate the green field and delta to use them like an iron sight. You then align them with the top of the optic that you are looking OVER rather than through at the target as you align the pointer of the delta with that target. So you are looking THROUGH the optic for your new substitute for your iron sight, but OVER it for your target just as you would look over an iron sight as you then bring it to bear on the target.

I hope that makes sense.