16" barrel is only 10" outside the firearm, makes it a bit longer, try to get some pics tonight VS the sub 2000 in length… long time ago, if you bought the IMI A or B with a additional stamp, you got the 10" and the 16" barrel in the hardcase…
So I am going to look into weapons like the CMR30 the S2K and other short carbine length weapons that a person who is getting older can operate reliably and with some skill and a minimum of training.
And that is the key issue. It takes lots of skill and practice to use a pistol effectively. Rifles and shotguns often have more recoil and more cost than many newer shooters want deal with.
A PDW is pretty intrinsic and one reason for the big fan base…a new shooter can hit the target pretty much from the start.
One of those breacher chokes came with my Tac 870. It’s in a drawer somewhere! I replaced it with a screw in 2 in. rifled choke for shooting slugs and sabots and an IM choke for buckshot rounds. Lots of this new “cool” gear reminds me of some of the latest fishing lures, made to catch fishermen, not so good on catching fish.
My wife’s soon to be son in law (at the time) built up a really nice, custom FDE FN15 for my wife. (Yeah she is that kinda gal and we that kinda family.)
He almost ruined the deal by mounting a serrated breacher muzzle break to a 5.56x45!?
Just think about that for a moment…savor it slowly and let it sink in. By this time I bet your eyes are growing wide as you realize how this expensive piece of dumb-assery could actually get someone hurt!
well, heres the pics against a sub 2000. UZI is a tad longer unfolded, but UZI is shorter stowed by a inch. measurements are shown. this is a IMI B type, 82/83 . paid $350 for the carbine with 16" barrel, sight tool, sling, dummy 10" barrel for display, hardcase ,
now ive seen IMI "B"s sell at the LGS, for$3500 each. with 1 mag and sling. simi autos…
barrel, which is also the chamber /receiver, takes less than a second to install and tighten by hand. good balance, nimble, and with the stock folded, even with the carbine barrel easy to maneuver . If i woulda bought a case of em in 83, i would be rich now. that was the days of 60$ red star SKS…
Well I am back. It was a long day but a lot of fun!
Had everything from bolt action .22 from 1940s, PC9s, ARs, shotguns, and pistols of every type. (It was supposed to be shotgun!)
I had a new RSO, timer, and Scorer I was training so I am pooped.
Everyone wants come back…the S2K and KSG was a hit with the crowd. And everyone liked the short course.
My tech guy was learning to score and he forgot to take videos except for the first ice-breaker stage that I was demonstrating. I’ll post all 15 seconds of it tomorrow.
@GOBLIN saw that…pretty cool! Makes me wish my time machine worked. Lol
Lets what would I go back in time for? Hmm…good topic for a new thread?
All you need is a Delorean, a flux capacitor and some plutonium. Now get to work!!!
So here is what happened yesterday. The guy doing the emails and communicating basically did a word of mouth campaign at the VFW, DAV, and Band of Brothers halls/meetings. So we got an all veteran group.
Could not have been better…wish I had thought of it!
But it was quickly apparent we need some “club guns” for these guys to use while they get started. Many of them brought weapons they have owned for decades but can no longer physically use!
My “slick” version of the S2K was a hit with the big holosun. Peep sight was a no-go! LoL
The KSG was a big surprise, out of all the shotguns available that was by far the groups favorite!
So we are thinking of getting them a couple of S2Ks and maybe a few of the KS7 (lighter and easier to cycle?)
whats the learning curve on the KSG/ KS7 on safty position /loading cycle? cause that age group, were more familiar with rem 870s, Mossburg 500’s Ithaca pumps, savage /stevens pumps ect. your going to hear a lot of, 'on my old Ithaca, all I had to do was hold the trigger down and pump" stories…
@GOBLIN I won’t lie to you the reload is horrible! If you buy a KS7 I doubt it will be any different than the KSG, when that sucker runs dry you are done!
What it does give you is a package that can be maneuvered around corners while still MAINTAINING COVER for that reason alone I would buy it!
LOLOL it cant be any worse than loading a lever action PW-87 shotgun, a SPAS, or even one of the old striker/SWD shotguns…
didnt think about the twin tubes, but loading a friends SWD sweeper when they first came out, on a 12 rnd with a drum, was time consuming… it was almost easier to take the drum off, pull the spool out dump the shells and reload after assembly. why I aint got one… and that folding stok on the SPAS , way it would bite yer thumb if it was to close, made a garand thumb look like a “love nibble”
@GOBLIN first you have to flip a KSG upside down or take a knee with the muzzle resting on the toe of your boot…
And no I am not joking!
Next you have to reach way down deep inside this little compartment lined with nails and razor blades and load 7 rounds in one tube, flip the lever and then load the other tube.
By this time you have to take a break to apply bandages, get a cup of coffee and a sandwich cause it takes so damn long you got hungry!
There is no ejection port so you can forget loading fast singles.
But once that bastid is finally loaded you have a 26" shotgun that weighs 6.5 lbs with a full length cylinder bore barrel. Its a great slug gun and shot opens quickly without any restriction. After you fire off that first 7 round you flick a lever and you got seven more!
After that you go to pistol or go back for another cup of coffee, sammich, and some more bandaids to repeat the loading process.
But for close quarters, manuever, using a corner to cover without exposing your entire body?
Im outta likes again for a few hours, LOLOL if they no port for ejection , where does it eject, down out the loading port?
This is the only video I got out of yesterday. I was demonstrating the stage with a new timer and score keeper so to be honest I wasn’t super hustling. Lol
its tellin me, that the video is un -available…